The truth will do!

[Wren]

We have a coal miner statue ...is very tall. Often a pijon (wp) sits ontop of his hat.

Lovely statue

Can't see it being taken away anytime soon

I glance over the evening post and the dispatch paper local stuff and all sorts.. adverts too

Kindness above all

 

[Bad_Influence]

I'm not in support of protecting anything.

It’s very sad that a single comment says so much. And even more sad that you don’t understand what you are too willing to remove.

There’s a saying, “If a man is not a socialist at 20 he has no heart. If a man is still a socialist at 35 he has no brain”.

You will understand one day Chloe.

 

[breakwake_]

Reminds me of the protests by the revived Cornish Stannary Parliament in 1999, removing all English Heritage signs from Cornish grounds. Actually got a Public Interest Immunity Certificate on the court case. Don't ask what that managed to achieve. Revived Cornish Stannary Parliament - Free Chat Rooms

 

[Steven113]

I have not read all of the posts on this thread, but in regards to all of countless Black lives Matter protests across the country over the last few weeks (whatever their reasons for attending) - Now is not the time!

Incase you have forgotten we are in the middle of a Global Pandemic. Those aerial shots seen in London of thousands of protesters crowded together with zero social distancing were shocking.

After months of having it drummed into us all to keep our distance from each other to save human lives and control the spread, i can only deduce that everyone there that day was a selfish thoughtless moron!

 

[ChloePsych]

It’s very sad that a single comment says so much. And even more sad that you don’t understand what you are too willing to remove.

There’s a saying, “If a man is not a socialist at 20 he has no heart. If a man is still a socialist at 35 he has no brain”.

You will understand one day Chloe.

I should have said I'm not in support of protecting or removing any monument. Each should be judged on their own merits. After WW2 Germany removed all statues of Hitler. Were they wrong?

I'm not a socialist, though people like you seem to think empathy is a socialist emotion. Do you think it's right to celebrate a slave trader? It's not like we're erasing history, we still know what the slave trade entailed. And his statue will end up in a museum, not melted down.

 

[Bad_Influence]

Whether you like it or not, Colston did a lot of good for the city, albeit from ill-gotten gains. If you want the statue gone why are you not clamouring for all the buildings, streets and schools that bear his name to be torn down or at least renamed? Bristol 'celebrates' Colston Day, when they eat Colston Cakes... should this event be scrapped too? You see it's not just about a statue... you have to see the bigger picture or no picture at all... you can't just pick and choose which one offends you.

 

[Steven113]

The Romans enslaved half of Europe, but i dont recall ever seeing people tearing down the colosseum like crazed animals amidst a global pandemic.

 

[WickedPerdition]

Debate should also rely on fact, otherwise it's just spouting sh**.

Oh, the irony. Oh, the irony.
So good, I had to say it twice.

 

[ChloePsych]

Whether you like it or not, Colston did a lot of good for the city, albeit from ill-gotten gains. If you want the statue gone why are you not clamouring for all the buildings, streets and schools that bear his name to be torn down or at least renamed? Bristol 'celebrates' Colston Day, when they eat Colston Cakes... should this event be scrapped too? You see it's not just about a statue... you have to see the bigger picture or no picture at all... you can't just pick and choose which one offends you.

aren't you paying attention? Buildings are being renamed as we speak.

 

[ChloePsych]

Oh, the irony. Oh, the irony.
So good, I had to say it twice.

still here, little man? You have a problem with facts?

 

[Wojcik]

I should have said I'm not in support of protecting or removing any monument. Each should be judged on their own merits. After WW2 Germany removed all statues of Hitler. Were they wrong?

I'm not a socialist, though people like you seem to think empathy is a socialist emotion. Do you think it's right to celebrate a slave trader? It's not like we're erasing history, we still know what the slave trade entailed. And his statue will end up in a museum, not melted down.

Hitler has been glorified for generations. Documentaries, films, TV series, you name it, they've done it. But I've never seen any out-cry's to ban these documentaries featuring Hitler and his portrayed life through these mediums. The people who are defacing and desecrating war memorials, tearing down statues illegally, are the same types of people who also glorify mass murderers and serial killers in the same manner. They make a mighty buck off of their name. We look at monsters such as Fred and Rose West, Ted Bundy, Ed Gein and him being a major influence for the Texas Chainsaw Massacre films. I think our general morality as a society is slightly convoluted because we seem to pick and choose which monsters to glorify.

I don't support the history of slavery, or the slave trade. But if we're going to start taking down statues, we might as well tear them all down, because a lot of those historical figures were in some shape or form involved in slavery. So there would be none left if we went down that route. I wouldn't oppose to those statues being placed in museums through a legal process though, where people can visit and learn about the history of Britain and it's role in the slave trade, and eventual abolition of the slave trade market.

What I'm seeing, especially in America right now, is a Democrat Party that are fully behind erasing their history in particular on injustices against black minorities. California in the eighties was one of the worst states for racism. So i think you'll see a lot of these leaders attempt to hide their history that treated minority groups in the worst ways imaginable.

 

[megs233]

History is what makes us.

 

[Steven113]

Here's a thought: instead of hoards of people ripping it down like dumb wild animals while potentially risking human lives amidst a global pandemic, all it took was for someone to get a metal plaque made up containing a little description of what this man really did, then just nailed it onto the bottom.

This wouldve informed future passers by of what he was really guilty of, instead of just condemning the statue to some dusty old corner of a museum where it will just be forgotten about.

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it." - George Santayana

 

[WickedPerdition]

still here, little man? You have a problem with facts?

You, my dear woman/girl are being heightest. Try being pleasant, for a change.
I have always sought fact as opposed to reactionary knee-jerk responses, which is what you appear to peddle incessantly.
For an alleged 'psychology student' you do not seem to have a great deal of insight.

 

[Moriarty]

aren't you paying attention? Buildings are being renamed as we speak.

Renaming a building that was bought with the profits of the slave trade makes the sin go away?
Surely most students should be in favour of tearing down their own universities, not just the statues, as they were bought using those profits.
Anything less is hypocrisy.

 

[supercookie123]

I think if we delve deeply enough, we will find a lot of what we have built and bought over the centuries has, in part at least, been procured with the gains of unsavoury origin. 'We' (a notion I struggle with a bit when referring to the 'us' of history) were very different; it was the NORM, perhaps, to be racist (because of a lack of education or understanding, I suppose). It might have been RESPECTABLE to have a servant and treat them with disdain. It may have been ACCEPTABLE to ignore children, as our inferiors (now, being young does not equate to being less intelligent or less important). The list of mad thinking goes on.

In the past, we had some ideas which seem pretty ridiculous to me today but it was how people thought. Ideas de rigueur at the time are now repulsive to us but AS WELL as being ridiculous in terms of racist thought and in possession of unrefined understanding and underdeveloped empathy, some people also did good. Times have changed; people need to broaden their minds. It's easy to fall off an overcrowded bandwagon.

I wonder if these people rippipng down statues believe their criminal damage to be lesser or worse than any other crime? Who decides? I wonder, if they dug deeply into their own family trees, equally squalid views would lurk there. I daresay they would. I wouldn't expect them to topple themselves for the sins of the fathers.

 

[Bad_Influence]

I think if we delve deeply enough, we will find a lot of what we have built and bought over the centuries has, in part at least, been procured with the gains of unsavoury origin. 'We' (a notion I struggle with a bit when referring to the 'us' of history) were very different; it was the NORM, perhaps, to be racist (because of a lack of education or understanding, I suppose). It might have been RESPECTABLE to have a servant and treat them with disdain. It may have been ACCEPTABLE to ignore children, as our inferiors (now, being young does not equate to being less intelligent or less important). The list of mad thinking goes on.

In the past, we had some ideas which seem pretty ridiculous to me today but it was how people thought. Ideas de rigueur at the time are now repulsive to us but AS WELL as being ridiculous in terms of racist thought and in possession of unrefined understanding and underdeveloped empathy, some people also did good. Times have changed; people need to broaden their minds. It's easy to fall off an overcrowded bandwagon.

I wonder if these people rippipng down statues believe their criminal damage to be lesser or worse than any other crime? Who decides? I wonder, if they dug deeply into their own family trees, equally squalid views would lurk there. I daresay they would. I wouldn't expect them to topple themselves for the sins of the fathers.

I think it’s safe to say the most folk understand that humanity is basically flawed. As a species we have made many mistakes, many errors of judgement. To ignore or eradicate those mistakes would mean that we haven’t learnt from them and can’t, in future, not make the same mistakes.
Moriarty put it well, if those who want to tear down our history then they should be willing to tear down it all. You can not pick and choose which screw ups we’ve made and only find offence in those. Either you want our past to be ignored or you have no right to benefit from it.

 

[supercookie123]

I think it’s safe to say the most folk understand that humanity is basically flawed. As a species we have made many mistakes, many errors of judgement. To ignore or eradicate those mistakes would mean that we haven’t learnt from them and can’t, in future, not make the same mistakes.
Moriarty put it well, if those who want to tear down our history then they should be willing to tear down it all. You can not pick and choose which screw ups we’ve made and only find offence in those. Either you want our past to be ignored or you have no right to benefit from it.

Indeed. We need to suck it up and deal with it. History happened.

 

[Bad_Influence]

Indeed. We need to suck it up and deal with it. History happened.

Exactly. But sadly it’s not the “we” who aren’t ‘sucking it up’ so to speak.

 

[supercookie123]

Exactly. But sadly it’s not the “we” who aren’t ‘sucking it up’ so to speak.

Pfft. Proper hard times. Dickens had NO clue!