do you believe in God

[WickedPerdition]

No one except the 23 people who have voted.

That statement is contradictory.
If 23 people have voted, how can no one be excepted?

 

[Kev45]

No one has had the audacity to vote in your 'survey'. (Then again, no one ever does).

Except for the 23 people who have had the "audacity" and which kinda cancels the bit at the end .

 

[Moriarty]

No, he didn't, what a completely ludicrous suggestion and that's not what he writes in context. This is the problem with gleaning knowledge courtesy of Google.




You have still selectively quoted him, the bit you hurriedly found on Google.




You don't determine what or what isn't acceptable on this forum.



Random words on a screen, states randomly, Marx had some foolish ideas.

LOL.

I often wonder why people dont want to hear contrary arguments.
For me it was part of growing up.
Had my beliefs challenged at the dinner table until I left home, then had them challenged at work, at uni and eventually by myself.
How does "You don't determine what or what isn't acceptable on this forum." help?
I never profess to knowing truth and to be fair neither can you because truth is an ephemeral thing that we believe when it suits us.

I always feel sorry for people who are "Certain".
Because one day they will realise they dont really understand reality the way they think they do.
It's a crushing realisation to come to understand you dont know feck all.
Believe me, I went through that and came back more confused than I have ever been.
Because I dont and cannot Know.
All I have is a rationality to hope, to help and to attempt to understand the intelligence and stupidity of human nature.
Its Love, its Hate, its Glory and its Downfall.

Human life is cyclic, as is science and religion.
Ideas and beliefs come and go, lives come and go.
Yet there is a constant, a search for truth.
Be that ones own beliefs or realities actuality, who are we to judge.

 

[Kev45]

Now theres a suprise.

The question was simply do you believe in God.
He wanted to replace god, or religion, with the state.

No, he didn't, what a completely ludicrous suggestion and that's not what he writes in context of the "bigger picture". This is the problem with gleaning knowledge courtesy of Google.

To actually quote Marx.

You have still selectively quoted him, the bit you hurriedly found on Google. You have also, despite the obvious cut and paste, not provided your source.

Now theres a suprise.

The question was simply do you believe in God.

Thankfully, you don't get to selectively pick and choose, and then determine, what or what isn't acceptable on this forum.

Marx was a great man, he had many wonderful ideas and some foolish ones, yet he is so often mis-quoted and misunderstood.

Online random describing some of Karl Marx's concepts as "foolish" and about as accurate as your claim Adolf Hitler was a "socialist".

foolish
adjective

unwise, stupid, or not showing good judgment:


Oh, dearie me.



LOL.

 

[Ingrid1965]

 

[Moriarty]

No, he didn't, what a completely ludicrous suggestion and that's not what he writes in context of the "bigger picture". This is the problem with gleaning knowledge courtesy of Google.





You have still selectively quoted him, the bit you hurriedly found on Google. You have also, despite the obvious cut and paste, not provided your source.





Thankfully, you don't get to selectively pick and choose, and then determine, what or what isn't acceptable on this forum.




Online random describing some of Karl Marx's concepts as "foolish" and about as accurate as your claim Adolf Hitler was a "socialist".

foolish
adjective

unwise, stupid, or not showing good judgment:


Oh, dearie me.



LOL.

Funny how I can quote a post before it was written.
Maybe there is something wrong with time?
Ah well, the mysteries of the universe.

 

[Kev45]

Karl Heinrich Marx (German: 5 May 1818 – 14 March 1883) was a German-born philosopher, economist, historian, sociologist, political theorist, journalist, critic of political economy, and revolutionary socialist. His best-known works are the 1848 pamphlet The Communist Manifesto and the three-volume Das Kapital (1867–1894); the latter employs his theory of historical materialism in an analysis of capitalism, representing his greatest intellectual achievement. His theories and ideas, and their subsequent development, are collectively known as Marxism, and have exerted enormous influence on intellectual, economic, and political history.

During his lifetime, Karl Marx published at least fifteen complete works, many of them multi-volume books, as well as numerous pamphlets, articles, and essays.

(Source Wiki)

The Communist Manifesto, to date, has sold upwards of 500 million copies, and is among the best-selling books (pamphlet) of all time. A UNESCO World Heritage publication, and Marx is taught in every single UK university in the UK (and globally).

An extremely important author who did/has exerted more global influence than any other single philosopher in history.

To glibly describe some of Marx's ideas as "foolish" is online buffoonery, and clearly those who make such simplistic remarks simply do not understand Marx nor Marxism (in context of the era) and nor any of the subsequent interpretations by the likes of Trotsky, Lenin, Zedong, Che Guevara, etc.

 

[xxwhite_dovexx]

why would a GOD any God let people suffer?.

Its called free will , besides how are we to know what door they left open spiritually .
Just say'n its hard question to answer really

 

[xxwhite_dovexx]

Allow me to show you the supernatural nature of the bible.History of the future being written.
Genesis chapter 5 genealogy from Adam to Noah.Adam,Seth,Enosh,Kennan,Malahelel,Jared,Enoch,Methuselah,Lamech,Noah.
We read those names in English and their meaningless to us,but names have meanings and roots and we can infer the root meaning of these names from the Hebrew.
Adam = Man
Seth = appointed
Enosh - mortal
Kennan = sorrow
Mahalelel = the blessed God
Jared = shall come down
Enoch = teaching
methuselah - 2 hebrew roots..Meth (his death ) Elah ( shall bring ) = his death shall bring
Lamech = lament,despairing
Noah = comfort
Now we have these names that are meaningless to us in English but lets look at them in their roots and we have a sentence.
Man (is) appointed mortal sorrow (but) the blessed God shall come down teaching (that) his death shall bring (the) despairng comfort.
Better believe it folks..God is real

They don't understand why God let's people suffer . I have a hard time with that one also .

 

[A_Son_of_God]

The reason God allows people to suffer is expressed in this article called, "Why Do Good People Suffer". It is a claim that humans have made that we can rule ourselves better by ourselves rather than with God's instruction. Therefore, God is not enforcing his laws on anyone, and we all reap the consequences of our own actions, let alone the actions of everyone else. A person can only be told some things, but if they have an opinion that is contrary to what works, only experience will teach them.

 

[A_Son_of_God]

(i havent read the whole bible because i always start over when i think i do wrong) . . . . . i heard the reason/reasons people suffer is in the bible

Jesus said this about our study of God's word. "You will know the truth, and the truth will set you free." Free from what? False teachings and obligations for one, that dominate many people's lives.
It is good you started reading the Bible. Keep up the good work mate. If you're reading it, be assured, you're not doing it wrong.

 

[A_Son_of_God]

If you believe in the Scriptures, that there is a God, creator of Man, then you must also believe that the Earth is only 6000 years old.

You can't cherry pick what is written in the Scriptures.

Also when you compare DNA (genes) to other Animals and even Plants, they fall in a perfect family tree.(Evolution).

As Dawkins explains below....But no one listens...!!!

Dawkins doesn't describe why for instance, hamsters are used for some human experiments regarding medicine, instead of monkeys, as the "perfect family tree" isn't so perfect.

The missing link is God. God made the blueprint, and it is highly possible he allowed his workers to work with the creation of what we see today. Proverbs tells us that God had a master worker. Therefore, if there was a "master" worker, it is reasonable to assume there were other workers to compare him to.

This tree becomes obsolete when we consider how medicine uses things like pigs for transplants (not monkeys or apes), mice and rats for experiments with blood (not monkeys or apes), etc. Also, when we look at chromosome pairs, and the fact that we share the same number with not only a species of monkey, but some rabbits, zebra, deer and antelope, etc., it starts breaking up this ideology that there's some simple pattern to be followed.

Richard Leakey - an evolutionist - does not agree also with this tree. He stated that a recent discovery at the time “leaves in ruins the notion that all early fossils can be arranged in an orderly sequence of evolutionary change.” Also to be noted are Niles Eldridge and Ian Tattersall, and how in their book "Myths of Human Evolution", these two evolutionists completely remove any "tree" of any kind, due to their thoughts that there has been on fossil evidence lending weight to the proof, but in fact the opposite.

Secondly, regarding this tree, it seems there are still disputes over which "perfect family tree" to follow, amongst those that still wish to follow one. It appears there are a handful for people to choose between, all based on their personal theoretical preferences.

Additionally, the Bible does not state that the earth is 6000 years old. How can we know that? Because before the first day started, the "earth" was already there, with water over the surface.So these days - the creative days that we read of - are a subsection of "days" of other things of which we're not privvy to. The Bible doesn't give scientific data for us to study. It lets us explore these things.
So the creative days started AFTER "...the earth was formless and void, and there was darkness upon the surface of the watery deep", and seven days are mentioned. But the seventh day started way back then, and has still not ended. So if we can even use Biblical chronology, we can see that the seventh day is well over 1000 years old, as even Christ was here almost 2000 years ago, and human history is WAY longer than even that.

 

[Altair]

Dawkins doesn't describe why for instance, hamsters are used for some human experiments regarding medicine, instead of monkeys, as the "perfect family tree" isn't so perfect.

The missing link is God. God made the blueprint, and it is highly possible he allowed his workers to work with the creation of what we see today. Proverbs tells us that God had a master worker. Therefore, if there was a "master" worker, it is reasonable to assume there were other workers to compare him to.

This tree becomes obsolete when we consider how medicine uses things like pigs for transplants (not monkeys or apes), mice and rats for experiments with blood (not monkeys or apes), etc. Also, when we look at chromosome pairs, and the fact that we share the same number with not only a species of monkey, but some rabbits, zebra, deer and antelope, etc., it starts breaking up this ideology that there's some simple pattern to be followed.

Richard Leakey - an evolutionist - does not agree also with this tree. He stated that a recent discovery at the time “leaves in ruins the notion that all early fossils can be arranged in an orderly sequence of evolutionary change.” Also to be noted are Niles Eldridge and Ian Tattersall, and how in their book "Myths of Human Evolution", these two evolutionists completely remove any "tree" of any kind, due to their thoughts that there has been on fossil evidence lending weight to the proof, but in fact the opposite.

Secondly, regarding this tree, it seems there are still disputes over which "perfect family tree" to follow, amongst those that still wish to follow one. It appears there are a handful for people to choose between, all based on their personal theoretical preferences.

Additionally, the Bible does not state that the earth is 6000 years old. How can we know that? Because before the first day started, the "earth" was already there, with water over the surface.So these days - the creative days that we read of - are a subsection of "days" of other things of which we're not privvy to. The Bible doesn't give scientific data for us to study. It lets us explore these things.
So the creative days started AFTER "...the earth was formless and void, and there was darkness upon the surface of the watery deep", and seven days are mentioned. But the seventh day started way back then, and has still not ended. So if we can even use Biblical chronology, we can see that the seventh day is well over 1000 years old, as even Christ was here almost 2000 years ago, and human history is WAY longer than even that.

life first began in the Ocean and started with bacterial mats on the Ocean floor. From that ALL life came.

In Biological terms a Hamster is no different to a Crocodile, if you dig deep enough into the Genes/Chromosomes/DNA History.

What separates them is Evolution by Natural Selection.

This is FACT. It is Proven and documented.

Pigs are used in Human Transplants because the common pig's 'Organs' match more closely to a Human's in Size, Structure and Function.

The 'Family Tree' is not obsolete. It's widely misunderstood that's all.

When you understand that... 'Life' started in the Ocean and all life we see today came after it, you begin to understand how complex life began.

The Bible Does teach us that the earth is only 6000 years old. If you interpret it correctly.

There will always be disputes regarding this.

As you say.. The bible doesn't give Scientific data. ( There's thought...!)

As Dawkins says in one of his video's ( Geologist 'Kurt Wise', Who has a PHG in Geology from Harvard!.. Said...'If all the evidence in the Universe pointed to an OLD earth' he would be the first to admit it, but he would still believe in a Young Earth because that is what 'Holy Scripture' teaches him.

As Dawkins says, you can't argue with a mind like that.

I would like to ask you a question. What does the bible say about Dinosaurs and Neanderthals?

An even bigger question....Why was the book of 'Enoch' deleted from the Bible?

 

[Altair]

The reason God allows people to suffer is expressed in this article called, "Why Do Good People Suffer". It is a claim that humans have made that we can rule ourselves better by ourselves rather than with God's instruction. Therefore, God is not enforcing his laws on anyone, and we all reap the consequences of our own actions, let alone the actions of everyone else. A person can only be told some things, but if they have an opinion that is contrary to what works, only experience will teach them.

The reason why a so called 'Caring GOD that loves ALL of us' allows Blood/Bone Cancer in Children is because of what exactly?

A child....Who has had zero chance to live or sin.

Come on.!

 

[Altair]

Something else for you to have a think about.

 

[A_Son_of_God]

life first began in the Ocean and started with bacterial mats on the Ocean floor. From that ALL life came.

See, from my studies, I see the chances of this being possible so far from reasonable that it becomes non-scientific to presume it happened like that. To say "It happened though, because we're here" is cyclic reasoning, and does not prove how bacteria formed from mush. Bacteria are not simple. They are complex. There is no such thing as a simple life form, because all life forms rely on other systems to be in place for them to exist, let alone often, other things to live off.

In Biological terms a Hamster is no different to a Crocodile, if you dig deep enough into the Genes/Chromosomes/DNA History.

All I can say to this is, "Really?" How do you deduce this?

What separates them is Evolution by Natural Selection.

This is FACT. It is Proven and documented.

No, it isn't. It is NOT fact, nor proven and documented. Prove it for me then. Let me see your documented proof that "Evolution is by Natural Selection".

Pigs are used in Human Transplants because the common pig's 'Organs' match more closely to a Human's in Size, Structure and Function.

So, more so than a monkey or apes? Interesting.

The 'Family Tree' is not obsolete. It's widely misunderstood that's all.

We're talking about "trees" in the plural here. Not one. For instance, there are Linnaean and Phylocode, just to mention two. There is much that is not in agreement between different scientists in these areas, and ones that just don't fit, or throw spanners into their conventions.

When you understand that... 'Life' started in the Ocean and all life we see today came after it, you begin to understand how complex life began.

That doesn't make sense mate. That's just a statement. It is not agreed on by the scientific community. Some for instance, believe that ... wait up, you said it! Life came from STARS! So, either life came from the stars, or it came from the ocean. Which one was it? It can't be both, can it?

The Bible Does teach us that the earth is only 6000 years old. If you interpret it correctly.

There will always be disputes regarding this.

The Bible plainly says, "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth". THEN it says, "Now the earth was formless and desolate, and there was darkness on the surface of the watery deep..."
THEN it says that God made light come to be, and that THIS was the first day. God's first creative day was that of making light visible on the surface of an already existing earth, with water upon it, in a universe he'd already made. (Genesis 1:1-5)
And as for the seventh day, it did not end. It is still going. (Genesis 2:3)

As you say.. The bible doesn't give Scientific data. ( There's thought...!)

As Dawkins says in one of his video's ( Geologist 'Kurt Wise', Who has a PHG in Geology from Harvard!.. Said...'If all the evidence in the Universe pointed to an OLD earth' he would be the first to admit it, but he would still believe in a Young Earth because that is what 'Holy Scripture' teaches him.

As Dawkins says, you can't argue with a mind like that.

On this, I agree with you. If a person has a preconceived idea, and claims that the earth is 6000 years old, after being shown scriptural proof that this is not the case, there is no way to argue nor explain anything to that person, as it is like explaining the road rules to a penguin.

I would like to ask you a question. What does the bible say about Dinosaurs and Neanderthals?

It doesn't specifically mention dinosaurs, although it does mention things like the great sea monsters of the past. But at the same time, I read an article on Archaeopteryx for instance, and it was claimed that this ancient dinosaur predated any bird, but it was later to be found WITH fossils of other birds at the time.

There is much evidence of giant creatures who have disappeared off the earth. Just because the Bible doesn't mention it doesn't mean they're not there though. I mean, there is nothing in the Bible stating they didn't exist. We can theorise (and only theorise) many different reasons as to why they were here, or even what they are. But we really don't know. The truth won't be revealed until the resurrection, if indeed then at all.

An even bigger question....Why was the book of 'Enoch' deleted from the Bible?

It wasn't. It's a later addition. I appreciate there are theories on it, but it's a later work. Why can I say that? Because it is not mentioned until a later date. People claim that Jude quotes from it, but it is more likely that Jude quoted from a common source at the time. But these works were not part of the Bible canon. There are many works prior to the Council of Nicaea to show that the Bible was already collated and in agreement in the majority of cases. The earliest goes back to 170CE, but even before then, the apostles had a gift of the holy spirit, which was to "understand inspired sayings". These "gifts" of the spirit were not passed on down the line, but were ONLY passed on by the laying on of the hands of the apostles. Those given the gift could not pass it on. They could only do what they were given the gift of. Thirty years after Jerusalem's destruction - approximately - the apostle John wrote the caps on the Bible - namely his three letters, his gospel account, and before these, the book of Revelation.
The same can be said of the Hebrew Scriptures before it, and for instance, why Maccabees - although historically accurate in the case of one of the books, just wasn't inspired to be part of the Bible canon. There is evidence that the books we have today are the same books that Jesus had (the Hebrew ones, I mean) and used.
Edit: The Book of Enoch may have been an earlier work. Revising my understanding of the Book of Enoch - although I have read it (and have a copy of it, or at least a translation), I don't dwell on these apocryphal works unless necessary, and I do forget things.
The evidence is that it is not Bible canon, and the reason it is not part of it, is because it did not meet the qualifications of being an inspired text.
For instance, in what is called the FIRST letter to the Corinthians, Paul states in it that he had written to them earlier (1 Corinthians 5:9). So why is THIS letter called 1Corinthians, and not 2Corinthians? Because not all letters of Paul were inspired of God, just as any other writing about Jesus, God, the Jews, Moses, Abraham or even Enoch, were not inspired of God.

 

[A_Son_of_God]

Something else for you to have a think about.

Richard Dawkins is irrational. He is on a campaign to fight an invisible man. LOL Scientist? Or extreme boofhead? Something tells us that he's got another motive.

 

[A_Son_of_God]

The reason why a so called 'Caring GOD that loves ALL of us' allows Blood/Bone Cancer in Children is because of what exactly?

A child....Who has had zero chance to live or sin.

Come on.!

It is the same reason why you - if you had a sick child - would allow them to undergo great pains to make them better if they had a life-threatening disease. We have that life-threatening disease, in the very fact that we inherited it from our sick forefather, and we have been unable to buy ourselves out of it. We are all cursed to just die, but we were meant to live forever.
So God has undone this damage through means that you most likely don't understand at this stage (which is fair, as it's a study in itself), but to prevent it from happening again, God is allowing us to continue to sow what we sow, and reap the consequences of it. God isn't causing the deaths. It is you and I. By the choices we make. By the way we HAVE to live to survive in this system. We have to use transport to get to work. We have to eat certain food, prepared a certain way. We have to partake in a system that is poisoning the planet. We're stuck, and it appears condemned, but it isn't. It is only to show that we - you and I - are stuck in a way of living that we are unable to do things about, because the core of the system is sick. So it is being allowed right now so that all those people who think they know better are allowed to step up and prove what they claim as to their ungodly solutions to the problems. God is not involved. He's letting us - whoever of us want to do it - to prove our claims. The evidence dreadfully shows failure though on our part so far. In fact, God already knows we'll fail, as we weren't created to dominate over each other. He'll repair it in the future. There will be a resurrection, and no more sickness, nor death. But this issue needs to be addressed now, completely, so that the universe can go on in harmony once again when God re-creates, on the eighth day. God has stated this is what he will do, and it is THEN - on God's timetable - when he'll undo it all. Still, this is why we as humans suffer, and innocent babies die. They die because us humans have provided the situations for these things to happen. WE are doing it. Not God.
They were born with this inherited error - sin - from their parents. Namely, you and me.

 

[Kev45]

You simply can not have a rational evidence based debate with anyone at all, whoever they are, who would deny the right to life for an innocent child who would otherwise die, a blood transfusion for example, solely based on that individual's own personal religious belief. God allegedly gave 'man' "free will"... except when it comes to innocent children, the 'rights' and parental 'ownership' of those children and who get no free will at all.

The same male dominated patriarchy that forbids abortion or tolerates abortion if one repents and begs forgiveness from God.

They can disguise their true intention all they like, behind multiple endless layers of often opposing biblical translation, but it ALWAYS, without exception, ends up in exactly the same position it started from.



Straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak.

"“Today God’s servants are engaged in a warfare, a spiritual, theocratic warfare, a warfare ordered by God against wicked spirit forces and against false teachings. God’s servants are sent forth as sheep among wolves and therefore need to exercise the extreme caution of serpents so as to protect properly the interests of God’s kingdom committed to them. At all times they must be very careful not to divulge any information to the enemy that he could use to hamper the preaching work.“ Watchtower 1957 May 1 pp.285-286."

 

[NickUK]

It is the same reason why you - if you had a sick child - would allow them to undergo great pains to make them better if they had a life-threatening disease. We have that life-threatening disease, in the very fact that we inherited it from our sick forefather, and we have been unable to buy ourselves out of it. We are all cursed to just die, but we were meant to live forever.
So God has undone this damage through means that you most likely don't understand at this stage (which is fair, as it's a study in itself), but to prevent it from happening again, God is allowing us to continue to sow what we sow, and reap the consequences of it. God isn't causing the deaths. It is you and I. By the choices we make. By the way we HAVE to live to survive in this system. We have to use transport to get to work. We have to eat certain food, prepared a certain way. We have to partake in a system that is poisoning the planet. We're stuck, and it appears condemned, but it isn't. It is only to show that we - you and I - are stuck in a way of living that we are unable to do things about, because the core of the system is sick. So it is being allowed right now so that all those people who think they know better are allowed to step up and prove what they claim as to their ungodly solutions to the problems. God is not involved. He's letting us - whoever of us want to do it - to prove our claims. The evidence dreadfully shows failure though on our part so far. In fact, God already knows we'll fail, as we weren't created to dominate over each other. He'll repair it in the future. There will be a resurrection, and no more sickness, nor death. But this issue needs to be addressed now, completely, so that the universe can go on in harmony once again when God re-creates, on the eighth day. God has stated this is what he will do, and it is THEN - on God's timetable - when he'll undo it all. Still, this is why we as humans suffer, and innocent babies die. They die because us humans have provided the situations for these things to happen. WE are doing it. Not God.
They were born with this inherited error - sin - from their parents. Namely, you and me.

So the parents of said children should feel guilty because its their fault?
What a fucking sick system of thinking that is...