Free Will - Does it Exist?

[A_Son_of_God]

I was reading an article from a Newscientist magazine - an interview with Dr Robert Sapolsky - and his explanation of free will not existing.

I found it extremely weak, and was kind of disappointed that a person with such potential should overlook the choices he's been allowed to make, including the very choice to say there is no free will.

Here's the article:

Why free will doesn't exist, according to Robert Sapolsky

It's hard to let go of the idea that free will exists, but neuroscientist Robert Sapolsky says that society starts to look very different once you do

www.newscientist.com

What do you think?

 

[ladymuck]

I don't believe in free will simply because I think our lives are all planned out. We think we are making decisions but actually everything has already been decided.

 

[Confused_Fred]

The concept of free will versus determinism is a longstanding philosophical debate. While some people believe that humans have the ability to make choices independently of any external factors (free will), others argue that our actions are determined by various factors such as genetics, environment, and past experiences (determinism).

Your perspective that our lives are all planned out aligns more closely with a deterministic viewpoint. This perspective suggests that every event, including human actions, is the inevitable result of preceding causes. In this view, the future is predetermined by the past and the present, leaving no room for true freedom of choice.

However, it's essential to acknowledge that this is just one perspective among many. The question of whether free will truly exists remains an open and complex philosophical question, with arguments and counterarguments from various schools of thought.

Ultimately, whether you believe in free will or determinism can shape your understanding of the world and influence how you approach decision-making and personal responsibility. It's a deeply personal and philosophical question that individuals may grapple with throughout their lives.

 

[Moriarty]

Religion likes the idea of determinism as it can be used to control people.
Everyone else likes the idea of freedom because it doesn't.

Yet the saying there are no atheists in a fox hole rings true.

Most people lean toward individual freedom and choice, because they have control over that.
Yet when death approaches, they begin to pray.

I think its human nature to want to be free, yet hopes, perhaps there is something beyond death.

Survival instinct at it best.

So in the end, we are all determinist when we lose control of our lives or look for meaning being simply existing.

If we live our lifes on what we can see now, then we have the sh** we can see now.
Politics is simply power, relationships are simply comfort, or in some cases power.
It's all to do with simply thinking how can we make this life better for ourselves now, not in an afterlife.
Which is money.
Power equates to money in our society, hence..
We have replaced religion with capitalism for greed, or socialism for equity.

None work, because we are all not equal.

 

[Chip_TheViking]

If we live our lifes on what we can see now, then we have the sh** we can see now.

this for me, living in the moment is the only way we can understand what "free will" even is & how it's not even an important question.
what is free will?
*Free will is the ability of individuals to make choices and decisions autonomously, without being constrained or predetermined by external factors.*
to a degree it's simply a statement of fact, to a degree we all have apparent free will but not total free will.
I think people who question free will are in some way questioning their level of freedom as it's closely related to, referring to the ability of individuals to make choices and decisions on their own without being constrained.
if you sit & look at what it is thats observing the question of "free will" then you won't feel the need to ask the question "will" ... what is will?

think about this, if you had the choice to own free will, and you chose not to have it....hehe

 

[Moriarty]

think about this, if you had the choice to own free will, and you chose not to have it....hehe

That is whats called a Democrat in the USA.

Capitalism fails, we know that.
Socialism fails, we know that.

The left, the right, they all lead to really bad outcomes when taken to far.
We need something else which isn't a "Third Way" that involves total control of the lesser for the greater apparently.

When someone comes up with that, they will be both loved and hated.
Society is to complex to have it based on "One belief" it has to be diverse.
As in, if you believe in something, move there and live that way.

Which wont work either because if one section of society cordoned off gets succesful, they will just get invaded by another.
Or someone will come in to attempt to undermine it.

Oh wait.

Isn't that what we have now?

 

[Chip_TheViking]

That is whats called a Democrat in the USA.

I can't disagree because I don't know what a Democrat in the USA means but I do know if someone labels someone into a category it's because they don't understand their viewpoint, so it's a way of making it easier to accept, you wont believe this but I never learned what left or right is & i have no idea what WOKE means I can guess it means a troll?
I've no interest in looking up what left or right means either I don't waste my time on politics

 

[Moriarty]

I can't disagree because I don't know what a Democrat in the USA means but I do know if someone labels someone into a category it's because they don't understand their viewpoint, so it's a way of making it easier to accept, you wont believe this but I never learned what left or right is & i have no idea what WOKE means I can guess it means a troll?
I've no interest in looking up what left or right means either I don't waste my time on politics

Considering Politics is the single biggest factor in everyones life, I have never understood how people "Don't do politics"
It governs everything in our life economically.
It governs what we can and cannot do, or say.
It governs where we can live and how much it costs us to do so.
It governs all facets of legality in our relationships.

Makes me chuckle when people have views and say they are apolitical, because no one is.
Everyone has an opinion on politics, even if they say they have no opinion on politics.
We all have bias when it comes to societal belief.

 

[Chip_TheViking]

Considering Politics is the single biggest factor in everyones life

Not mine or many people I know.

It governs everything in our life economically.

not mine I grow a lot of my own food potatoes, strawberries, harvest eggs from the chickens..go directly to the farmers, .so on

It governs what we can and cannot do, or say.

politics create laws that Govern what you say? it's your choice to live this way I choose to be free.
what is it that you believe the government can stop you saying?

as for the things I choose to do I use common sense, as long as I don't hurt anyone & don't do anything immoral, I do what I like.

It governs where we can live and how much it costs us to do so.

Not me, don't pay council tax never have never will.

It governs all facets of legality in our relationships.

I pity if this is your reality I really do.

apolitical, because no one is.

arguing that even by choosing to be apolitical, one is still making a political statement and contributing to the status quo, is putting them in a box just to fit your own reality the same way when religious people claim atheism a religion.
"you have to be in a religion you have to have a political view - because I do see"?

may be focusing on your own well-being and happiness is more important than being involved in politics
otherwise when your old you'll just realise all your life you've lived as a simple muggle enchanted by the words of politicians ability to enact real change, when they never do they just lie on that we can all agree.
(the statement above is not my political view lol just an observation of fact).

 

[Moriarty]

Not mine or many people I know.

not mine I grow a lot of my own food potatoes, strawberries, harvest eggs from the chickens..go directly to the farmers, .so on

politics create laws that Govern what you say? it's your choice to live this way I choose to be free.
what is it that you believe the government can stop you saying?

as for the things I choose to do I use common sense, as long as I don't hurt anyone & don't do anything immoral, I do what I like.

Not me, don't pay council tax never have never will.

I pity if this is your reality I really do.

arguing that even by choosing to be apolitical, one is still making a political statement and contributing to the status quo, is putting them in a box just to fit your own reality the same way when religious people claim atheism a religion.
"you have to be in a religion you have to have a political view - because I do see"?

may be focusing on your own well-being and happiness is more important than being involved in politics
otherwise when your old you'll just realise all your life you've lived as a simple muggle enchanted by the words of politicians ability to enact real change, when they never do they just lie on that we can all agree.
(the statement above is not my political view lol just an observation of fact).

View attachment 14998

“It's an universal law.
Intolerance is the first sign of an inadequate education.
An ill-educated person behaves with arrogant impatience, whereas truly profound education breeds humility.”
Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Does make one wonder what education is implied.
Is it possible to make every member of a population educated?
Is it possible to make every member of a population equal?

An education should make one humble in ones own reality.
To simply state, I am lucky because I was born with an intellectual thirst.
Is not a luxury all people have.

Physically we should all be seen as equal under the law, or under god, whichever one chooses.
Spiritually, has little to do with equaty apart from "I believe"
A Theocracy is just as bad as a Democracy when people simply "Believe" without question.
Is not merit the best way to allow promotion to positions where knowledge is needed?

To again quote Solzhenitsyn :-

“Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either, but right through every human heart and through all human hearts.
This line shifts Inside us, it oscillates with the years.
And even within hearts overwhelmed by evil, one small bridgehead of good is retained.
And even in the best of all hearts, there remains an unuprooted small corner of evil.

Since then I have come to understand the truth of all the religions of the world:
They struggle with the evil inside a human being.
It is impossible to expel evil from the world in its entirety, but it is possible to constrict it within each person.”

I think, that the way to expel evil is as Solzhenitsyn says, is through humility.

 

[A_Son_of_God]

Considering Politics is the single biggest factor in everyones life, I have never understood how people "Don't do politics"

My reasons for not being involved in politics are that I've already voted for a government. I did so by my baptism, which was a public declaration I was supporting God's kingdom.

The laws and principles are written in a book for us. We can learn them if we want, and as they're discussed, understanding is streamlined, as we may have misunderstood what something meant before, or misapplied it somehow.

Jesus stated to be "no part of the world", and gave a bit of an explanation of what this meant. He also stated this to Pilate.

So anyway, that's why I don't do politics. If you wish to change something, good for you. As for me, the solution to the evils of mankind don't belong to mankind. They belong to God, and God has appointed Jesus as a king to fix these problems. Currently, he is breaking up the works of the former leader, Satan.

Makes me chuckle when people have views and say they are apolitical, because no one is.
Everyone has an opinion on politics, even if they say they have no opinion on politics.

I agree. We can all have opinions. I saw a protest yesterday, and they were talking about justice. So an angry man with a mob forcing people to hear his preaching...sounds like something I get accused of. LOL
If questioned, I know we'd get into an argument. Why? Because justice is a very broad thing. What he should be doing firstly is working on being just himself. This is harder than it seems, as we all have things we feel we deserve, and there are circumstances where we individually have to miss out so that others can be helped.
But having opinions and then making laws to enforce them - this is one of the reasons there has been much injustice.
As for me, I'm not involved, as I've already put my opinion in. I'm supporting God's kingdom.

We all have bias when it comes to societal belief.

Yeah, for sure. We've all grown up in our own shoes as such.