The Female Experience

BasildonBond

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This is a brilliant post, I agree with many of the points that you make. Please do not think I am trivialising what you say, but when you reach my age - 56. It is all in the past.
When I was a young woman, I had quite a high libido, I put myself in quite a few difficult situations. I did not value myself very highly. It was only when in 2016, when I went through a surgical menopause, that I began to value myself. But I'm not sure if given the opportunity, I would change things. I chose to live a certain way, but in doing so I became a sex object.
When you reach my age, a woman becomes invisible. I don't feel too despondent, in a way it has set me free. But the harsh truth is, I am no longer looked at, just looked through. I hope I've made some kind of sense.
Not sure that women of your age become "invisible". I think you're being too harsh there. Maybe to a lot of younger men, but not all of my gender by any means.
 

hell2bwith76

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Next thing you`ll be demanding is a tag and a curfew for all males over a certain age .
There isn`t any "natural " instinct in males to choke women when they are involved in heavy sex ! I`ve never heard of that until very recently !
I do know ,from memory ,that many husbands would get drunk after work and beat their wives and also beat their kids for no reason other than being drunk .
The men who kill their children and themselves is again a very new occurence . The Phsycologists should be looking at what has changed recently to cause this . Is it due to more freedom for women to act like men ?.
 

hell2bwith76

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Next thing you`ll be demanding is a tag and a curfew for all males over a certain age .
There isn`t any "natural " instinct in males to choke women when they are involved in heavy sex ! I`ve never heard of that until very recently !
I do know ,from memory ,that many husbands would get drunk after work and beat their wives and also beat their kids for no reason other than being drunk .
The men who kill their children and themselves is again a very new occurence . The Phsycologists should be looking at what has changed recently to cause this . Is it due to more freedom for women to act like men ?.
 

hell2bwith76

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Perhaps it might be a good idea to begin with for a ban on all pornographic movies ?. Many ideas come from them and entre a mans brain due to the fact (maybe) that their woman seems to enjoy that sort of movie when young .?
 

CrazyCatLady

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Your right of course, I have seen it in my own life.

I was simply juxtaposing it with with how in my view a man should behave.

I find it shameful to admit that you are right on almost all of the points you have raised most in this port but in others.

However, I simply cannot agree with them all.

I do think there should be a sharing of responsibility as I saw in my own family.

That life is not the "Angry Old Men" patriarchy that is forming so many opinions these days.

They are pointless and self destructive as they supply no answers to a real question that society needs to discuss with reason, not emotional rhetoric which most activists spout.

Men and women are different, not by much, but society and technology have brought those differences to the fore.

How we address equity and eqaulity are very different questions, as is who wants them and why.

I would suggest the Wests current appropriation of intersectionality is nothing but the privilaged speaking for those they deem unable to speak for themslves.

The arrogance of which is beyond belief.

Texas introduced the 6 week law.. for abortion.
I am not decided on abortion, it has to many factors I cannot take into account, I see both sides argument.
However, someone who has come out to say refute the new law, as they use ritual abortion in thier services.
The Satanic church.

No Im not religious, but really.

Even Salon got on board.
Why Satanists may be the last, best hope to save abortion rights in Texas

Is this what we want, this division.

When both sides are wrong, both cant be right unless people have faith in one or the other, then they believe.
You can’t agree with my points, because you lack in understanding of how it feels to be a woman- just as I can’t understand what it feels like to be a man. To be able to view women in the way your gender does. However- and this is a big however- I haven’t expressed what my views are on women yet and I guarantee they would surprise you.

Is that ‘angry old men’ or ‘angry old white men’? Because let’s face it, there’s a difference- nowadays, there is a media image forming and no, it’s not positive and no, it’s not fair. But neither is the view that women ask to be raped by the clothes they wear and that’s a view we’ve had to live with. It’s not nice for a whole gender to be generalised, is it?
And that comes back to our first exchange- where I suggested that the man was getting a taste of his own medicine. Your gender created many negative stereotypes for ours that lasted generations and didn’t even stop with women fighting back. Yet as soon as there is a negative stereotype of men, quickly males react to it and expect sympathy for being stereotyped.

Equality and humanity should not be divided by what is West and East. There is no recognition of privilege when speaking about women’s rights. I used to be of the opinion that I had no right to comment on a woman’s experience in more regressive countries- it was their business, what did I know! Until I worked and lived amongst women who were from those countries and trying to escape the patriarchal abuse at home- in England! The battle of cultures, being ostracised by family and old friends for wanting something other than to be married and to have children. There’s also the guilt that the women in your family still suffer, while you start your new life. Also do you know how many little girls I watched (9-10yrs old), being little girls before the Summer holidays, but coming back, ‘wrapped up’ because during the 6 weeks away, their father found them a good husband them back home? Forget arrogance about culture. When it comes to morality, it’s a world issue, because the issues in these countries are not insular.

Abortion is another issue entirely. There’s the obvious women’s rights element, but it also involves a whole new level of morality that would need to be covered and I don’t think the posters round here could stomach it! Lol
 

Moriarty

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You can’t agree with my points, because you lack in understanding of how it feels to be a woman- just as I can’t understand what it feels like to be a man. To be able to view women in the way your gender does. However- and this is a big however- I haven’t expressed what my views are on women yet and I guarantee they would surprise you.

Is that ‘angry old men’ or ‘angry old white men’? Because let’s face it, there’s a difference- nowadays, there is a media image forming and no, it’s not positive and no, it’s not fair. But neither is the view that women ask to be raped by the clothes they wear and that’s a view we’ve had to live with. It’s not nice for a whole gender to be generalised, is it?
And that comes back to our first exchange- where I suggested that the man was getting a taste of his own medicine. Your gender created many negative stereotypes for ours that lasted generations and didn’t even stop with women fighting back. Yet as soon as there is a negative stereotype of men, quickly males react to it and expect sympathy for being stereotyped.

Equality and humanity should not be divided by what is West and East. There is no recognition of privilege when speaking about women’s rights. I used to be of the opinion that I had no right to comment on a woman’s experience in more regressive countries- it was their business, what did I know! Until I worked and lived amongst women who were from those countries and trying to escape the patriarchal abuse at home- in England! The battle of cultures, being ostracised by family and old friends for wanting something other than to be married and to have children. There’s also the guilt that the women in your family still suffer, while you start your new life. Also do you know how many little girls I watched (9-10yrs old), being little girls before the Summer holidays, but coming back, ‘wrapped up’ because during the 6 weeks away, their father found them a good husband them back home? Forget arrogance about culture. When it comes to morality, it’s a world issue, because the issues in these countries are not insular.

Abortion is another issue entirely. There’s the obvious women’s rights element, but it also involves a whole new level of morality that would need to be covered and I don’t think the posters round here could stomach it! Lol

I can and do agree with the points you make because I have seen how some men act and have spoken to many women about the effect it has on them.
I have several women who are great friends, my best mates 4 daughters (who universaly call me Uncle Knobhead, thx Peter Kay you asshole) being the main ones, who ring me to talk about sh** they wont discuss with thier parents.

They are now in thier 20's, 30's and 40's and I have seen the change in both them and society as a whole concerning the topics you discuss.

Now, the "Angry old men" or "Angry old white men" tropes are a whole different thing.
As I said before, should women cover up to prevent men being tempted, or to keep them locked away to prevent men from taking advantage of them, as certain religions espouse?
After all we cant lock the men up, look around you when you walk outside, everything not natural is designed, sourced and built by men.
(I'll wait for the blasting I'm gonna get for that sentence :).)

This I can't answer, as in your experience, it would seem if our society was like that it you may have debatably fared better.

Thats a whole other topic I wont touch right now, because we all know there are a**h**** out there, but there are those who have an ideology to fall back on for it use it as a defence.
Which is why I worry about Sharia courts in England.

But thats a whole other debate that may just get me banned.

I do have to ask though, how many men have you seen in your life, I mean seen as in just walking down the street, probably thousands if not hundreds of thousands.
Say 50 years old, start at 18, thats 32 years, in the 11000 plus days you have walked down the street, how many men have you seen lets say 5 a day, probably a low number, so of the over 50000 men you have seen and have seen you, how many have been a prick?

Anyway, thats a debatable subject all its own, generalisation in society, or perhaps stereotyping.

Lets go back to people in general.

For my experience I have fecked up many times in my past relationships, I should have seen the writing on the wall, I should have listened more to the brain than the heart and I should not have been so fecking niave.

The very fact that I was brought up to be a "gentleman", to always respect women to a fault, is the reason I am single with a string of bad choices in my past and a lack of trust for a future.

Are some women a**h**** who take men for a ride, are some women violent, domineering, overbearing and controlling, yes of course they are, no one can refute that.

Are some men happy with that, yes, it usually mean they dont have any responsibility, the women controls the relationship.
Is it healthy, hell no.

Its the same the other way round, my mothers friend has a son she cannot even talk to because he argued with his father and the father demanded she cut all ties with thier son because of it, this was over 30 years ago when the son had just come back from serving in Northern Ireland and was strung the feck out on stress, probable PTSD and barbituates.
Is that healthy, again, hell no.

So were do we find common ground.
We can't, it's not that men and women want different things, it's that individual people want different things.

There are women who want to dominate a relationship, just as there are men who do, there are men who wish to be kept just as some women do.

Finding 2 people who want to form a relationship that way often trends toward friction, calls that "Your to dominating and/or controlling" or "Your weak, stand up for yourself" end up breaking the relaionship (almost always, there are happy kept dominated women and happy kept dominated men)

Finding 2 people who want to share, to be a co-operative unit, thats fecking hard.

My best mate and his wife have been together over 40 years, they argue all the time, it's what works for them.
They still hold hands on the back of the sofa so it looks like they are both stretching, even when simply watching tv at night, its sickening :)


We can go into the evolutionary psychology of why these things happen, I would love to discuss that, but thats to much for today, my brains had a few beers while I was writing this:)


Just as a quick side note.. I must ask about "man was getting a taste of his own medicine".

Langauge warning.
Yes a women can be called a S*ag or a W*ore by men, yet friend or even a best mate can be called a Player by them to.

How many times has a man warned you that his mate, or another bloke, is a Player.
It's a chat up tool men use to deflect attention to themselves, showing they are honest and warning the girl not to trust their "mate".
Usually used by the uglier guy of the group, does it work?

It's not a compliment, its a tool to break the ice when meeting women.
Shows your trustworthy and have her best interest at heart if you play it right.

I dunno, do women do that with other women, do they say "Dont go near her, she's a Slapper" to a guy they fancy?

That women tend more toward reputation destruction psychologically than outright violence.
Is it a trait shared by men who are lower down the "pecking order" ?
It's a question for debate perhaps.

Note in this rambling diatribe, I never blame women for the faults in my life, just my own lack of wisdom.
The responsibility was to choose wisely what I did or did not do.

So i will say again, the reason you have suffered is because those men in your life who have caused you problems are either simply a**h**** or those who where not brought up properly, in which case the burden lies upon the parents.

Just as my parents, who brought me up to trust women implicitly were at fault because they never warned me that they can be a**h**** to.

So in conclusion, it's either that all men are a**h****, or you were not taught about real life from an early age.
You can or cannot take some personal responsibility and run with it but at least admit you have made mistakes to.
Or you can blame society and men as a whole for the very real discrimination that exists, on both sides.
I cannot judge you either way, I dont have all the facts about your life, only my own and what I learn from others.
But I do think the real world lies somewhere in the middle between fact and opinion.

"If someone hides the lid, life is like a box of chocolates, you never know when your gonna get a feckin nut".

As for abortion, not going there, your right, to much venom with it.
 

hell2bwith76

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I can and do agree with the points you make because I have seen how some men act and have spoken to many women about the effect it has on them.
I have several women who are great friends, my best mates 4 daughters (who universaly call me Uncle Knobhead, thx Peter Kay you asshole) being the main ones, who ring me to talk about sh** they wont discuss with thier parents.

They are now in thier 20's, 30's and 40's and I have seen the change in both them and society as a whole concerning the topics you discuss.

Now, the "Angry old men" or "Angry old white men" tropes are a whole different thing.
As I said before, should women cover up to prevent men being tempted, or to keep them locked away to prevent men from taking advantage of them, as certain religions espouse?
After all we cant lock the men up, look around you when you walk outside, everything not natural is designed, sourced and built by men.
(I'll wait for the blasting I'm gonna get for that sentence :).)

This I can't answer, as in your experience, it would seem if our society was like that it you may have debatably fared better.

Thats a whole other topic I wont touch right now, because we all know there are a**h**** out there, but there are those who have an ideology to fall back on for it use it as a defence.
Which is why I worry about Sharia courts in England.

But thats a whole other debate that may just get me banned.

I do have to ask though, how many men have you seen in your life, I mean seen as in just walking down the street, probably thousands if not hundreds of thousands.
Say 50 years old, start at 18, thats 32 years, in the 11000 plus days you have walked down the street, how many men have you seen lets say 5 a day, probably a low number, so of the over 50000 men you have seen and have seen you, how many have been a prick?

Anyway, thats a debatable subject all its own, generalisation in society, or perhaps stereotyping.

Lets go back to people in general.

For my experience I have fecked up many times in my past relationships, I should have seen the writing on the wall, I should have listened more to the brain than the heart and I should not have been so fecking niave.

The very fact that I was brought up to be a "gentleman", to always respect women to a fault, is the reason I am single with a string of bad choices in my past and a lack of trust for a future.

Are some women a**h**** who take men for a ride, are some women violent, domineering, overbearing and controlling, yes of course they are, no one can refute that.

Are some men happy with that, yes, it usually mean they dont have any responsibility, the women controls the relationship.
Is it healthy, hell no.

Its the same the other way round, my mothers friend has a son she cannot even talk to because he argued with his father and the father demanded she cut all ties with thier son because of it, this was over 30 years ago when the son had just come back from serving in Northern Ireland and was strung the feck out on stress, probable PTSD and barbituates.
Is that healthy, again, hell no.

So were do we find common ground.
We can't, it's not that men and women want different things, it's that individual people want different things.

There are women who want to dominate a relationship, just as there are men who do, there are men who wish to be kept just as some women do.

Finding 2 people who want to form a relationship that way often trends toward friction, calls that "Your to dominating and/or controlling" or "Your weak, stand up for yourself" end up breaking the relaionship (almost always, there are happy kept dominated women and happy kept dominated men)

Finding 2 people who want to share, to be a co-operative unit, thats fecking hard.

My best mate and his wife have been together over 40 years, they argue all the time, it's what works for them.
They still hold hands on the back of the sofa so it looks like they are both stretching, even when simply watching tv at night, its sickening :)


We can go into the evolutionary psychology of why these things happen, I would love to discuss that, but thats to much for today, my brains had a few beers while I was writing this:)


Just as a quick side note.. I must ask about "man was getting a taste of his own medicine".

Langauge warning.
Yes a women can be called a S*ag or a W*ore by men, yet friend or even a best mate can be called a Player by them to.

How many times has a man warned you that his mate, or another bloke, is a Player.
It's a chat up tool men use to deflect attention to themselves, showing they are honest and warning the girl not to trust their "mate".
Usually used by the uglier guy of the group, does it work?

It's not a compliment, its a tool to break the ice when meeting women.
Shows your trustworthy and have her best interest at heart if you play it right.

I dunno, do women do that with other women, do they say "Dont go near her, she's a Slapper" to a guy they fancy?

That women tend more toward reputation destruction psychologically than outright violence.
Is it a trait shared by men who are lower down the "pecking order" ?
It's a question for debate perhaps.

Note in this rambling diatribe, I never blame women for the faults in my life, just my own lack of wisdom.
The responsibility was to choose wisely what I did or did not do.

So i will say again, the reason you have suffered is because those men in your life who have caused you problems are either simply a**h**** or those who where not brought up properly, in which case the burden lies upon the parents.

Just as my parents, who brought me up to trust women implicitly were at fault because they never warned me that they can be a**h**** to.

So in conclusion, it's either that all men are a**h****, or you were not taught about real life from an early age.
You can or cannot take some personal responsibility and run with it but at least admit you have made mistakes to.
Or you can blame society and men as a whole for the very real discrimination that exists, on both sides.
I cannot judge you either way, I dont have all the facts about your life, only my own and what I learn from others.
But I do think the real world lies somewhere in the middle between fact and opinion.

"If someone hides the lid, life is like a box of chocolates, you never know when your gonna get a feckin nut".

As for abortion, not going there, your right, to much venom with it.

Not an answer to everything but you should watch the TV program "Married at First sight" ( channel 4 or 5 UK i think).
A set of experts ,male & female ,choose sets of males and females who they consider compatible and arrange for them to be married ( officially !) The women and men have never even met and are married . It`s very interesting to see how they behave and it shoots all the Psychology out the window imo .:).
 

Omega

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Not an answer to everything but you should watch the TV program "Married at First sight" ( channel 4 or 5 UK i think).
A set of experts ,male & female ,choose sets of males and females who they consider compatible and arrange for them to be married ( officially !) The women and men have never even met and are married . It`s very interesting to see how they behave and it shoots all the Psychology out the window imo .:).
All these realities are staged - They have cameras following them around.

I've even watched a whole series of some of the formats of these sort of realities in order to see what they were about (last year as we were in lockdown).

Each series usually lasts for 5/6 episodes..

The one about married at first sight is, as you say about (4) couples who don't know each other and get married.

None of the 4 couples (from the series I watched) remained married.

These formats are created in order to keep the masses glued to the screen (bit like football for men) to distract them from what is going on around them (Politically and Socially)

They are basically empty vessels.
 
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